just_for_blogging's blog

By just_for_blogging, history, 6 weeks ago, In English

Hi everyone, please don't judge me on basis of rating on my this account. It is my alternative account to freely ask query/doubts related to CP (without fear of downvoting). In every div2 contest I am able to 4 problems normally. I have been doing CP since 6 months on codeforces but I rarely find Algorithms based problems in Div2 contests. First 3 problems are usually greedy/constructive or some observation based. 4th problem is usually on graphs/dp or some logic based. Rest of the problems sometime require algorithms but most the time they are constructive/dp/greedy problems. At max, bfs/dfs and some basic graph algorithms based problems are there. I am not pointing that their is issue with current problems types. These problems really help in problem solving but these kinds of problems fails to test algorithmic skills of participants.

I want to see more algorithmic problems in Div2. If it is not possible to change current problems format in Div2, MikeMirzayanov may can bring up a new contest series whose problems will be more oriented towards algorithmic skills. This thing can help to bring more variations in CF contests and problemset.

I know this issue have been raised few times ago and was rejected by saying that Div1 contains more algorithmic problems and if anyone wants algorithmic problems then he/she should reach div1. But I think it is not justified to keep algorithmic problems to Div1 only. I know it's difficult to make new algorithm based problems for each contest but I think it is needed to bring algorithmic skills into back into CF specially for Div2 contestants. I only want to say that CF is best ever platform which conducts frequent contests (smoothly) without compromising with problems quality but thing is that I thinks CF lacks algorithmic problems for DIV2.

Meanwhile Can anyone recommend me platform which conducts frequent contests which are more algorithm based.

 
 
 
 
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6 weeks ago, # |
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Div2 contests are oriented towards beginner & intermediate level participants & Div1 contests are for more seasoned contestants. Giving extremely algorithm heavy tasks in Div2 will make a contest unapproachable for starters. Right now, I believe the Div2 contests are adequately balanced.

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    6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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    I completely agree with you that Div2 are mainly for beginners and intermediates but refraining experts and stable specialists from being tested on algorithms problems is not beneficial for them. I know it is difficult to change format of Div2 contests but instead CF can have new algorithm oriented contest series. It can be conducted monthly at beginning so as to check response from whole CF Community.

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    6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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6 weeks ago, # |
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Disadvantage of this type of contest- If u took slightly more time in A then ur contest is going to be bad,cause u dont have enough question to prove ur capabiity. After 800,900 its direct 1700+

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6 weeks ago, # |
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you do 4 problems in every div2? you should be in div1 right now

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    6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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    One needs to fast solve 4 problems (specially when there are 6/7 problems) to reach div1. I am relatively slow at solving problems due to which currently I am stuck on expert.

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      6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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      Then focus on your speed without complaining....Redcoders enjoy div2 cf problems as they are not classic ones and require thinking. You can see secondthread's commentary over div2 contest.

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        6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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        First of all I never criticized Div2 contest. I just gave suggestion of either giving algorithmic problems more space or create separate contest series for it. You can let this topic go as some experienced and better coders have given good time to answer this topic. And instead of giving me advice, you should focus on your problem solving skills first.

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          6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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          Wow! such an arrogant reply...unlike you I'm replying with my real id, not from an alt.

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          6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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          well said

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6 weeks ago, # |
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Algorithmic problems are reaching a saturation point i think atleast for Div 2 level. Plus its extremely difficult for a problem setter to create a problem that hasn't been published before.

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6 weeks ago, # |
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As a setter of two Div. 2 rounds, there have been some difficulties on setting algorithm-based problems in 2A~2C:

  • You can't expect too much algorithm knowledge from low-rated participants. In fact, simple DP, BFS/DFS or maybe Dijkstra is most likely maximal for 2C, and there are not many algorithms that are easier than them.
  • If you use an algorithm that is close to the hardest for the difficulty, you can barely put any more things that require further observation. This means the problem will most likely become a typical problem, that can be found everywhere in many OJs.

So basically if you want to set an algorithm-based problem in 2A~2C, you need to find a problem that:

  • uses very popular algorithm that even a beginner would've learned already
  • requires nontrivial, but still easy observation
  • makes sure that there are no similar ones out of thousands of problems that require that same algorithm and easy observation

It's not like it's impossible to make such problems, but you should also see that as the time goes on, it gets even harder and harder to avoid conflict with other similar problems. This is why the setters usually try to come up with a problem with a single creative idea instead of trying to combine with a specific algorithm.

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    6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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    Yes it is difficult for problem setter to make DIV2 more oriented towards algorithms but can't we find another way to improve and test algorithmic skills of experts/specialists. I perform good in CF contests but I fail miserably in contests which are more oriented towards algorithms. This is due to the fact that my algorithmic skills are not being tested on regular basis. So if I am not being tested on algorithmic skills on regular basis, I don't push myself hard to improve them. It is spirit of competition that pushes us hard to improve ourselves. May be if we start something new to improve algorithmic skills then after some time we may see improvement in algorithmic skills of participants. This may help everyone to perform better at Competitions which requires more algorithmic.

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      6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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      basically all points from djm03178 still hold.

      you just shift the problem further. If expert/specialist want 2c/2d with harder algorithm (segment tree, fenwick tree, etc) the problem will most likely become typical. If expert/specialist want some algorithmic problems that require some observations, simple BFS, DFS, Dijkstra is max.

      In fact, this problem occur till higher rating (you won't expect 2100-2400 tasks that require FFT, maxflow, or other very advance algorithm either)

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        6 weeks ago, # ^ |
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        Thanks for giving your time to answer my queries ..vince and djm03178. I feel now that I will be more motivated to reach Div1 as soon as possible, so that I tackle more algorithm based problems in Div1.

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6 weeks ago, # |
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Could you give some examples of what you mean by algorithm-based problems? Constructive, greedy, dp, and graphs sound like categories of algorithm-based problems to me.

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6 weeks ago, # |
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Plot twist : This is his original account. This blog is just to gain contribution. Since, it is hard to gain rating.

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6 weeks ago, # |
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MikeMirzayanov may can bring up a new contest series whose problems will be more oriented towards algorithmic skills

It already exists, it's called "educational rounds".

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6 weeks ago, # |
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What do you mean by this? Oh come on, I only attempt Problem A and B on the fear that rest of the problems may be algorithmic heavy!!!!! How dumb I thought. BTW you reached so high in just 6 months. That's nice.